AMD Phenom II X4 940 & 920: A True Return to Competition
by Anand Lal Shimpi on January 8, 2009 12:00 AM EST- Posted in
- CPUs
Hooray, AMD is Overclockable Again
Since the introduction of the B3 stepping Phenom that solved the TLB bug (along with improved yields), overclocking a Phenom has been a fairly painless process. This is especially true with the Black Edition series and a well designed motherboard based on the 790FX, 790GX, or 780a chipsets. While the Phenom has not offered the same overclocking headroom as the latest Penryn processors that typically offer a 1GHz improvement on the middle to upper range processors with air-cooling, it is not uncommon to see the Phenom BE series offering a 600~800MHz improvement in clock speeds.
AMD has proven in early demonstrations that the Phenom II x4 will offer overclocking headroom similar to the Penryn series. Early production sample processors have clocked anywhere from 3.9GHz on air to 4.4GHz on water and all the way up to 6.3GHz on LN2. We have matched their results on air-cooling and been impressed with the potential headroom offered by the new 45nm manufacturing process on extreme cooling setups. In fact, the latest retail steppings that AMD displayed this past week showed significant improvements in overclocking headroom compared to the press samples we utilized. Our 940 topped out at 3.9GHz, which is not bad, but after reviewing AMD’s results and seeing some early retail numbers on the forums, the expectation level for air-cooling is now set to the 4.1GHz range with the 920 hitting 3.8~3.9GHz on the right motherboard.
We have retail processors arriving shortly for additional overclocking tests (we will push HTT/NB settings); in the meantime, we have some interesting numbers to present with our press samples. In our overclocking tests today we are utilizing the Phenom II X4 940, Phenom 9950 Black Edition 125W, Core 2 Q9550, and the Core i7 920. Besides having a strong processor, a well-engineered motherboard, premium memory, excellent cooling, and proper power supply are all essential elements in obtaining stable and high clock speeds when overclocking.
With that in mind, we are utilizing the DFI LP DK 790FXB-M2RSH (790FX), ASUS Maximus II Formula (P45), and DFI LP UT X58-T3eH8 (X58) motherboards for testing. We also tossed in the Corsair HX1000 power supply along with memory from Corsair and G.Skill featuring their TR3XGG1600C8D 6GB DDR3-1600 and F2-8800CL5D-4GBPI DDR2-1100 4GB kits respectively. The balance of the test system consists of a WD Caviar Black 1TB HD, Blu-ray drives from Sony and LG, Vista 64 Ultimate, and our ABS Canyon 695 case.
In a twist from our normal overclocking results, we decided to utilize the retail air-coolers from Intel and AMD to provide a more realistic out-of-box experience when overclocking. We based today’s test results on how high we could overclock on stock voltages and then by increasing voltages until we ran out of cooling headroom with the retail coolers.
| Processor | Highest Overclock (Stock Voltage) | Highest Overclock (Overvolted) | % Increase over stock | Overvolted Vcore |
| AMD Phenom II X4 940 (3.0GHz - 1.32V) | 3.2GHz | 3.9GHz | 30% | 1.52V |
| AMD Phenom 9950 BE (2.6GHz - 1.26V) | 3.03GHz | 3.38GHz | 30% | 1.45V |
| Intel Core i7-920 (2.66GHz - 1.32V) | 3.83GHz | 4.0GHz | 50% | 1.35V |
| Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 (2.86GHz - 1.22V) | 3.48GHz | 3.91GHz | 38% | 1.35V |
We disabled the power management features and manually set the voltages to stock values. Leaving the BIOS settings at Auto will generally result in the BIOS auto-leveling voltages to handle the increased clock speeds for the processor, memory, and bus speeds. We did not get very far with our particular 940 sample as it only reached 3.2GHz resulting in a dismal 7% increase in clock speed. With the exception of the PCMark Vantage TV/Movies test suite and our Flight Simulator X benchmark, this 940 processor passed all other tests at 3.45GHz. The Phenom 9950BE had a 17% increase in clock speed while the i7 920 managed a stunning 50% improvement in clock speed. The E0 stepping Q9550 managed a 23% improvement in core speed.
In our second test, we manipulate voltage settings ranging from the normal VCore/VDimm to VTT/IOH/PCIe until we reached the load limits on the retail air-coolers. Higher-end air-coolers improved clock speeds slightly (3~5%) while dropping core temperatures up to 9C in certain cases.
The clocking situation improved greatly with our 940 once VCore rose to a final 1.52V. We actually hit 4GHz but needed 1.58V to do it. This resulted in a few crashes due to temperatures, but we also noticed our particular CPU sample just was not stable at 4GHz+ even with additional voltages and cooling. The results for the two Intel processors are simply superb in this particular test with the 9950BE managing a respectable 30% improvement in clock speeds, matching that of the Phemom II percentage wise.
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poohbear - Thursday, January 8, 2009 - link
this is fantastic news! and just when i was about to upgrade from my ancient s939 system to a C2D system, seems i might be sticking to AMD after all! thanks for review!PrezWeezy - Thursday, January 8, 2009 - link
For less than $20 more the i7 920 looks like it wins in every single test by a fair margin, doesn't seem like this is really all that competitive, considering the i7 is still in the "high price" phase. I can't believe it wont drop to the $275 mark rather soon which would put the XII 940 back to the same position the original Phenom was, too little too late.Roland00 - Thursday, January 8, 2009 - link
More expensive Motherboard+More expensive Ram makes i7 about 400 dollars more in coststrikeback03 - Friday, January 9, 2009 - link
How you figure? By the chart on page 4, it is less than $200. Even if you go for one of the $300 motherboards, you won't see a $400 difference.When I built my current system, E6600/P965/2GB DDR2 cost me over $600, and that was considered a decent mid-range system. As my primary use of computing power is Photoshop, I would definitely go for i7 even if cheaper motherboards do not become available.
Roland00 - Friday, January 9, 2009 - link
It isn't quite 400 but heremotherboard p45 vs x58 most x58 are 300 vs 100-120 for p45,
Ram, 6 gb of ddr3 is about 200, vs 50 or 60 for 6gb of ddr2.
For a nonstock cpu cooler you are talking 60 to 70 bucks with the i7 for it is a new socket and their is very few products for it. You can get a good cpu cooler for intel quad for 30 to 40 dollars.
Savings about 200+140+30=370
If you get things on sale you might be able to find 6gb ram for 150, cpu for 230, and you may be able to get the motherboard cheaper if you get one of the basic versions but you are still talking about 300 more.
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I am not saying i7 isn't worth the extra money, it is still new tech but it does show beneficial gains (on encoding, minimum frame rate on games, and overclocking) but right now the motherboards and ram is expensive.
BSMonitor - Friday, January 9, 2009 - link
You are rounding up on i7 side and rounding down on the core 2 side. It is not $50 for 6GB of DDR2. It is not only $300 for x58. I have seen them for $200. I have seen 6GB DDR3 kits for $140 too.It's like we are talking about bare entry into Core 2 and Phenom II, but enthusiest for i7. Why does one need 6GB to entry into i7? 3GB would be reasonable and ~$70-80.
Phenom II is cute yes, but nothing to jump on.
Roland00 - Friday, January 9, 2009 - link
I am rounding up on the I7 side for like most people I buy things with tax (for my state charges tax on internet transactions.) In addition many people buy their equipment in stores such as fry's, microcenter, comp usa, etc.370 times 8.25% tax rate (my area's sales tax) is...400 dollars and 52 cents
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And no I am not overpricing the ram or similar equipment. Go to Fry's, Microcenter, or some other store and you will see the prices I listed or much higher.
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Regardless you seem to be missing the point, the original poster I was responding to was saying i7 was only 25 dollars higher, and I said that was wrong for you have to figure in the platform costs.
PrezWeezy - Friday, January 9, 2009 - link
You were right, I had forgotten about the new socket and DD3. Even so, using the parts Anandtech used, the i7 is about $187 more expensive than the PII (pun totally intended). The C2D with a Q9400 though is only $44 cheaper than the i7. Almost all of that has to do with the motherboards used here, and I'm sure you could find a combo of motherboard/CPU that would bring the price closer but that's besides the point.calyth - Thursday, January 8, 2009 - link
"In theory, the AMD design made sense. If you were running a single threaded application, the core that your thread was active on would run at full speed, while the remaining three cores would run at a much lower speed. AMD included this functionality under the Cool 'n' Quiet umbrella. In practice however, Phenom's Cool 'n' Quiet was quite flawed. Vista has a nasty habit of bouncing threads around from one core to the next, which could result in the following phenomenon (no pun intended): when running a single-threaded application, the thread would run on a single core which would tell Vista that it needed to run at full speed. Vista would then move the thread to the next core, which was running at half-speed; now the thread is running on a core that's half the speed as the original core it started out on."Anand, read that sentence again.
The problem isn't AMD designing a chip with broken CnQ. The problem is that Microsoft, after so many years, still can't write a scheduler. The problem persists on XP too. The thread that handles the mouse would rev up, causing the chip to switch p-state. Switching p-states takes time, and because of exclusive caching on AMD chips, when the scheduler puts the same thread on different cores, it causes the L1 & L2 to be ineffective.
I have trouble in WinXP with CnQ on if I move my mouse, but not surprisingly, the same Phenom chip works like a chap in Linux. Because the scheduler isn't an idiot, and 1GHz is more than enough to handle mouse input.
AMD erred in fixing a software problem in hardware. Independent p-states saved some power if only a single thread needed the speed.
Zak - Thursday, January 8, 2009 - link
Well, I hope AMD won't lose the momentum, because right now there isn't that much to celebrate: they've barely caught up with Intel's 2 years old CPU line:(Z.